Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

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MsMagicAmerica
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Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by MsMagicAmerica » 24 Jan 2022, 22:19

In an interview with the LA Times (posted Sunday night) Damon stated that Taylor Swift "doesn't write her own songs" because she's a co-writer. Swift blasted him on Twitter.

Article below:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/ ... 235080139/

vitekm
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by vitekm » 24 Jan 2022, 22:23

And here´s her tweet with mad numbers of RTs and likes:

https://twitter.com/taylorswift13/statu ... 5675812866

It 24/1/2022 and Damon finally made it in America!

Neal Zeal
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by Neal Zeal » 25 Jan 2022, 03:54

My understanding is that TA Swift does actually completely write some of her songs, but many of them (usually the best ones) are co-written.
Looking at the credits for her standout album, 1989, it seems she only wrote one of the songs herself (This Love). All the rest were co-writes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_(Tay ... ck_listing

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MsMagicAmerica
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by MsMagicAmerica » 25 Jan 2022, 05:10

But she's still a songwriter.

What I don't get is why in his mind she's not one because she co=writes and yet in his mind Billie Ellish is even though she co-writes with her brother (which he even stated in the interview).

If he doesn't like her music, that's fine, but don't be a dick about it.

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by Caitlin » 25 Jan 2022, 08:01

A bold move when so many of his biggest hits are co-written. Oh well, it's been a while since we've had a bit of excitement I guess.
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JackS
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by JackS » 25 Jan 2022, 08:55

The apology isn't great... putting it down to clickbait. I think the problem people have is with what he is quoted as saying in the article, not just the headline. Unless he is suggesting that his words have been paraphrased or edited down.

All a lot of nothing that will blow over, but still - either apologise properly, or don't bother

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by jonathas » 25 Jan 2022, 10:03

It's a funny one to get embroiled in as I thought it was fairly well established that Taylor Swift was heavily involved in the writing of her own songs. It's not like Damon, who is these days very well connected amongst mainstream musicians, to get it wrong. Unless he knows more than we do. My understanding of her most recent records is that someone else wrote the music and she wrote the lyrics and melodies, but that's still song-writing as far as I'm concerned. Maybe her role is exaggerated and Damon is letting an industry secret out of the bag - but I think he probably just got it wrong. Shame his apology was not a bit more fulsome.

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by dougharrison » 25 Jan 2022, 11:11

MsMagicAmerica wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 05:10
But she's still a songwriter.

What I don't get is why in his mind she's not one because she co=writes and yet in his mind Billie Ellish is even though she co-writes with her brother (which he even stated in the interview).

If he doesn't like her music, that's fine, but don't be a dick about it.
It seems odd that the main musical contributor to Gorillaz is against co-writing, especially as 9/11 of his solo album that he is currently promoting is credited as co-written.

I think your last sentence nails it.

As an aside is anybody buying that the apology is from Damon rather than a Transcopic intern?

Neal Zeal
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by Neal Zeal » 25 Jan 2022, 11:31

jonathas wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 10:03
It's a funny one to get embroiled in as I thought it was fairly well established that Taylor Swift was heavily involved in the writing of her own songs. It's not like Damon, who is these days very well connected amongst mainstream musicians, to get it wrong. Unless he knows more than we do. My understanding of her most recent records is that someone else wrote the music and she wrote the lyrics and melodies, but that's still song-writing as far as I'm concerned. Maybe her role is exaggerated and Damon is letting an industry secret out of the bag - but I think he probably just got it wrong. Shame his apology was not a bit more fulsome.
Nope, as I mentioned before in this thread, she sometimes writes the entire song (music and words) but usually she co-writes.
And in my opinion, the songs she writes entirely herself are usually the weakest but she is still technically a songwriter.
Take a look at the Folklore credits for example (which is a flipping great album). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folklore_ ... ck_listing
All songs have a co-writer except 'My Tears Ricochet'.

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by jonathas » 25 Jan 2022, 11:41

No desire to do down her work - I think she's great. But just for ref, according to Wikipedia, re. Folklore:

Swift and Dessner "were pretty much in touch daily for three or four months by text and phone calls." He would mail her folders of instrumentals, and she would write the "entire top line"—melody and lyrics, and "he wouldn't know what the song would be about, what it was going to be called, where she was going to put the chorus."

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by vitekm » 25 Jan 2022, 11:47

I dont want to speak up for Damon just because its Damon, but maybe he was reffering to the situation when profesional writer is involved who then doesnt participate in recording, he / she just submits the work he / she was hired for - as opposite to a situation when a band like Blur work together in the studio to complete song writen (mostly) by one member. (And that the way Billie Eilish and her brother operate is closer to later approach than when a profesional writer is writing songs for established pop star.)

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by idreamofpikas » 25 Jan 2022, 11:57

MsMagicAmerica wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 05:10
But she's still a songwriter.

What I don't get is why in his mind she's not one because she co=writes and yet in his mind Billie Ellish is even though she co-writes with her brother (which he even stated in the interview).

If he doesn't like her music, that's fine, but don't be a dick about it.
How was he being a dick? He was asked a question about Swift and gave an honest answer.
  • "That doesn’t count. I know what co-writing is. Co-writing is very different to writing. I’m not hating on anybody, I’m just saying there’s a big difference between a songwriter and a songwriter who co-writes. Doesn’t mean that the outcome can’t be really great. And some of the greatest singers — I mean, Ella Fitzgerald never wrote a song in her life. When I sing, I have to close my eyes and just be in there. I suppose I’m a traditionalist in that sense. A really interesting songwriter is Billie Eilish and her brother. I’m more attracted to that than to Taylor Swift. It’s just darker — less endlessly upbeat. Way more minor and odd. I think she’s exceptional."- Damo
He was not saying Billie is more of a songwriter, he said that her and her brother's writing appeals to him more.

It is weird how thin-skinned Swift and her fans are.

Maybe he was wrong about her not being a songwriter, but looking at her credits the vast majority of them were co-written with someone else. My bet is that Damon had primarily heard about her Max Martin association and based his opinion on that.

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by idreamofpikas » 25 Jan 2022, 12:09

dougharrison wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 11:11


It seems odd that the main musical contributor to Gorillaz is against co-writing, especially as 9/11 of his solo album that he is currently promoting is credited as co-written.

Is he even against it? Pointing out the distinction does not mean he's against co-writing, just that he thinks there is a difference. What people seem to be ignoring is that his problem with Swift was not that she was not a songwriter, just that her music is not for him. He gave Billie as an example of 'modern pop star' who he does like the music of.



I love Elton, but I'd not refer to him as a songwriter either, he's a co-writer. And as an outsider looking at Taylor's discography, it seems she falls into that category as well. She co-writes with a lot of talented songwriters, it is hard to believe that they are just touching up her material, but have a decent level of involvement.

Damon interviews hardly get much traction so I can't imagine he knew his honest opinion on Swift would blow up, but his options seem to have been

  • Choose to lie about his thoughts about Taylor when the interviewer asked him about her
  • Look like an even grumpier old man by giving no examples of modern musicians he does like
  • Look even more sexist by bringing up a young male pop star to show he does like some modern music

Neal Zeal
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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by Neal Zeal » 25 Jan 2022, 12:35

I'd suggest that Damon clarifies that although the (large) majority of her songs are co-writes, she usually contributes a song or two per album that she has written entirely, and admit that he was at least wrong about this detail.
From the current response in the media, you'd be forgiven for thinking that Damon was completely wrong about the whole thing, and that she actually writes all her stuff single-handedly.

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Re: Damon pissed off Taylor Swift and all of her fans

Post by dougharrison » 25 Jan 2022, 12:42

idreamofpikas wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 12:09
dougharrison wrote:
25 Jan 2022, 11:11


It seems odd that the main musical contributor to Gorillaz is against co-writing, especially as 9/11 of his solo album that he is currently promoting is credited as co-written.

Is he even against it? Pointing out the distinction does not mean he's against co-writing, just that he thinks there is a difference. What people seem to be ignoring is that his problem with Swift was not that she was not a songwriter, just that her music is not for him. He gave Billie as an example of 'modern pop star' who he does like the music of.



I love Elton, but I'd not refer to him as a songwriter either, he's a co-writer. And as an outsider looking at Taylor's discography, it seems she falls into that category as well. She co-writes with a lot of talented songwriters, it is hard to believe that they are just touching up her material, but have a decent level of involvement.

Damon interviews hardly get much traction so I can't imagine he knew his honest opinion on Swift would blow up, but his options seem to have been

  • Choose to lie about his thoughts about Taylor when the interviewer asked him about her
  • Look like an even grumpier old man by giving no examples of modern musicians he does like
  • Look even more sexist by bringing up a young male pop star to show he does like some modern music
Based on the way the article is written he gives the distinct impression he doesn't consider TS a songwriter because she co-writes, which is fair enough. However then talks about BE being great, so why isn't co-writing different for her? That's before we get in to the vast majority of his own output being co-written.

You seem to have missed the option where he says he doesn't know much about TS's process and moves on? The interviewer directly asked the question "what about TS she is an excellent song writer?" surely a fair answer would be to say not keen, don't know much about her process and then talk about whoever he finds interesting?

There's no reason to suggest identity politics is at play here, or that Damon needs to answer in that way. He's worked with plenty of younger female musicians and AFAIK there are no accusations of him being misogynistic in his work. Or at least there weren't prior to this, which inspired a Guardian article inferring it due to the Adele spat.
Last edited by dougharrison on 25 Jan 2022, 17:13, edited 1 time in total.

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