The Clash thread

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AdvertBreak
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The Clash thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 19 Jan 2016, 00:06

Right. Where do we start? Okay, Cut the Crap.

So, its a lot worse, as a band effort, than people think. People tend to think its just Joe and Paul kicking out Mick and Topper and replacing them with three other guys, and that's why this isn't a Clash Album. But its worse.

Their manager Bernie Rhodes (who called himself Jose Unidos at the time for some bizarre reason) took control of the entire thing - it wasn't even Joe and Paul in control. And even though they still had Paul in the band, he was reduced to 'second bassist', and though Pete Howard is the drummer, bloody Rhodes used drum machines on every song. IIRC, Rhodes and Strummer wrote the songs together but they had got as far as unfinished demos when Strummer left the sessions and settled in Switzerland, and Rhodes apparently took care of the music writing. It was him who then added the dated synthesizers and football chant choruses to Strummer's unfinished demos, that making the most damage. If anything this is an unfaithful remix album of some unfinished demos. Also, I once read a YouTube comment (so it might be true, but) that said that Joe had no idea it had been finished when he stumbled across it in a Switzerland record store. He bought it home and with one listen knew they were finished.

So this album is essentially one person's vision and it isn't a Clash member's. But the songs aren't, mostly, that bad. But I say that considering most of them guilty pleasures. Strip away the production and you could make decent songs out of tracks like Dictator, Are You Red...Y, North and South etc (although some would still be terrible). We all know This is England is great though. The football chant chorus actually fits the song's depiction of the struggles of England 1985, like (as I seem to remember someone saying) an extra 'layer of authenticity', even though its just coincidence. But the song is a fine record. I got my motorcyclejacketbutI'mwalking all the time.

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by Lt Pinkerton » 19 Jan 2016, 00:22

You know what would be fun? Rating every song in London Calling, from 19 to 1. I'm gonna head off to bed now but this is definitely something we should do.
I'm also willing to fight anyone who dislikes Sandinista!

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 19 Jan 2016, 00:30

Sounds like fun. Also, Sandinista! is fantastic, although I never listen to it all at once.

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by Mrbriggs » 19 Jan 2016, 14:30

Sandinista has some great songs on it, if it weren't so long I would listen to it more.

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 20 Jan 2016, 00:08

The Clash are definitely among my all-time fave band. I resent when some claimed they were selling-out with "Sandinista" and "Combat Rock", but they were essentially expanding their sound from their punk roots... Mainly due to Mick Jones who followed that direction later on with BAD.....They were able to expand their audience in the process without really compromising their first wave of followers.

I tend to favor "London Calling" more than anything else...."Train in Vain" just does it to me all the time! If Strummer hadn't passed, they definitely would have reunited during their R&R HoF induction and perhaps would have recorded newer material. It was especially apparent at the time when Jones joined Strummer on stage to perform some classic Clash songs.... I could definitely go on and on about them!
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Re: The Clash thread

Post by Lt Pinkerton » 21 Jan 2016, 18:16

KingLouieLouie76 wrote:The Clash are definitely among my all-time fave band. I resent when some claimed they were selling-out with "Sandinista" and "Combat Rock", but they were essentially expanding their sound from their punk roots... Mainly due to Mick Jones who followed that direction later on with BAD.....They were able to expand their audience in the process without really compromising their first wave of followers.
Yeah I mean, London Calling is hardly a punk album after all. Sandinista! definitely expanded that eclectic approach, but it's not like it was something completely unexpected, I guess. Also, how the hell could you sell out with a triple album? :lol:
I love that story of Joe surrendering his royalties because he wanted it to cost the same as a regular LP, although I think I read somewhere that it wasn't exactly like that.

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 22 Jan 2016, 01:52

Lt Pinkerton wrote:
KingLouieLouie76 wrote:The Clash are definitely among my all-time fave band. I resent when some claimed they were selling-out with "Sandinista" and "Combat Rock", but they were essentially expanding their sound from their punk roots... Mainly due to Mick Jones who followed that direction later on with BAD.....They were able to expand their audience in the process without really compromising their first wave of followers.
Yeah I mean, London Calling is hardly a punk album after all. Sandinista! definitely expanded that eclectic approach, but it's not like it was something completely unexpected, I guess. Also, how the hell could you sell out with a triple album? :lol:
I love that story of Joe surrendering his royalties because he wanted it to cost the same as a regular LP, although I think I read somewhere that it wasn't exactly like that.

I agree.. just some out there unfortunately started to detest the Clash during that period for rather inane reasons.... They would have broken-up sooner if it wasn't for expanding their sound..otherwise of course they'd turned out to be one dimensional.... that's why they lasted as long as they did and would have further if it wasn't for all the internal pressures that lead to their demise....
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Re: The Clash thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 22 Jan 2016, 02:03

The Clash were deliberately bad businessmen for the favour of their fans in London Calling and Sanidinista! cases. Sometimes they were just bad businessmen anyway, i.e. signing a record deal that wouldn't support their touring, resulting in them losing lots of money when punks trashed their early shows haha.

London Calling and Sandinistia! are basically post-punk if any one thing particularly. Heck, Sandinistia! is almost anything but punk.

Also, the other score that needs to be settled: The production on Give Em Enough Rope. Good? I think its grand.

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Re: The Clash thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 22 Jan 2016, 07:22

AdvertBreak wrote:The Clash were deliberately bad businessmen for the favour of their fans in London Calling and Sanidinista! cases. Sometimes they were just bad businessmen anyway, i.e. signing a record deal that wouldn't support their touring, resulting in them losing lots of money when punks trashed their early shows haha.

London Calling and Sandinistia! are basically post-punk if any one thing particularly. Heck, Sandinistia! is almost anything but punk.

Also, the other score that needs to be settled: The production on Give Em Enough Rope. Good? I think its grand.

"Give Em Enough Rope" production was solid! It helped punctuate the message of each and every song the Clash were delivering in such a fantastic manner. Also, Topper joining the band obviously helped matters considerably.... To me, he's the most underrated member of the band.. they also immediately went downhill after his departure....Just again unfortunate he couldn't remain clean... but he was too far superior over Chimes, that's for sure!
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