The Genesis Thread

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by MrMagpie » 23 Jan 2015, 13:50

What I wish they'd release is the tape of the concert when they all reunited in the early 1980s for a couple of shows. It was professionally recorded (and filmed, rumor has it) but they've sat on it ever since!
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 23 Jan 2015, 20:15

MrMagpie wrote:What I wish they'd release is the tape of the concert when they all reunited in the early 1980s for a couple of shows. It was professionally recorded (and filmed, rumor has it) but they've sat on it ever since!

Oh...I definitely agree.....Here's some info regarding that concert..... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_of_the_Best" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 25 Jan 2015, 19:26

I remember asking about Genesis on the old thread but sort of dismissing later day Collins due to overwhelming consensus, but, risking a shooting, I just want to say that Invisible Touch has some great stuff on it. The Brazilian is essentially house music.

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Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 26 Jan 2015, 03:03

AdvertBreak wrote:I remember asking about Genesis on the old thread but sort of dismissing later day Collins due to overwhelming consensus, but, risking a shooting, I just want to say that Invisible Touch has some great stuff on it. The Brazilian is essentially house music.

I also love the later Genesis material! "The Brazilian" was a solid deep cut within an album that to me had several sentimental faves on there!
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by mr_spenalzo » 26 Jan 2015, 19:06

Nothing wrong with many later Genesis songs. Take "Hold On My Heart": on the surface, mushi Phil Collins stuff. But listen to it again, and imagine Neil Tennant singing it. It becomes a typically pretty Pet Shop Boys song. People would rate it a cut below "Being Boring" (but most songs are at least two cuts below, so no shame in that). Or "Tonight, Tonight, Tonight", brilliant song too. And if one song sums up everything that's wrong with the world nowadays it's almost 30 years old "Land Of Confusion"... seriously, someone like Thom Yorke still has to put it more succinctly than Collins: "there's too many people making too many problems".

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 26 Jan 2015, 19:52

Also Abacab is one of my favourite Genesis albums. I don't care for the ballads but everything else is great (even Who Dunnit, no honestly)

Keep it Dark should have been a hit. Dodo/Lurker is one of the most prog things they ever did so its silly to say they had stop being prog completely imo. Then Genesis and Invisible Touch are damn good. We Can't Dance only suffers from its length (just like pretty much every prog album from this era, like Floyd's The Division Bell or Yes' Union) - taking advantage of the CD, but there is some great tracks in there.

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 26 Jul 2015, 18:54

Just been playing Abacab, again,

Under

Rated

I really felt liking saying it. I mean, people tend to hate it (at the time at least) because
a) you're a punk and you think prog is silly
b) you're prog and you think post-Hackett Genesis is silly (you also think that they stopped being a prog band)
c) you're pop or just a general music fan but you hate Phil Collins like most people do for some silly reason

It's unfortunate. Apart from maybe the ballads, Abacab is a top record! It could have come from anyone else and been lauded, but by being Genesis, it would be deemed "uncool" by non-prog fans, and by being post-Hackett genesis, it would be deemed uncool by Genesis fans themselves. Indeed, looking at reviews online, Allmusic have given it 4.5/5 (yes!), but other people have reservations. Who Dunnit? is considered their worst song ever (are they fucking kidding me?). It's seen as a pop album, the first of the Genesis albums since Phil started his solo career - and yet it's still definitely art rock, and often, without a shadow of a doubt, prog (just listen to Dodo/Lurker! That's 110% prog) By Abacab's last vital few minutes being chopped off the single version, the "pop" tag is further attached, even though said minutes feature interesting synth work typical of Genesis. If you want a fine art rock song fit for a single, then the album's best track, Keep it Dark, should satisfy.

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by MsMagicAmerica » 26 Jul 2015, 19:07

I'm gonna be honest, I haven't listened to Abacab in years. I LOVE "No Reply at All" "Abacab" & "Man on the Corner" & like "Keep it in the Dark" but I don't remember the rest, but perhaps I'll give it another spin tonight.

btw, off topic, but AdvertBreak, what is your first name?
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 26 Jul 2015, 19:12

May I ask why?

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by MsMagicAmerica » 26 Jul 2015, 19:33

Just curious, you post on here so much & I only know you as AdvertBreak that's all.
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 26 Jul 2015, 19:48

Ah, okay. Lee

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 27 Jul 2015, 09:08

Several began to laud Genesis as far back as "Duke" because most believed they sold-out or just compromised their sound, but I believe they wouldn't have had much sustaining power if they continued in the direction they did w/Gabriel and Hackett. Several progressive bands during that time encountered the same situation, mainly because it wasn't video appealing enough for MTV.

"Abacad", "Genesis", and later "Invisible Touch" really helped propel them to newer heights (along w/Collins solo career)......"We Can't Touch" was a solid farewell album of the Phil Collins period.
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by Mallard No. 22 » 30 Jul 2015, 07:41

I agree, Advert Break. Genesis were good in the new wave period, just as they had been in the prog rock/Gabriel period. :D

Many great artists did transcend these periods. ELO, Abba etc.
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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by AdvertBreak » 30 Jul 2015, 15:18

It's strange how Yes got acclaimed for 90125 when that album is perhaps the best example of prog gone pop, whereas Invisible Touch and Three of a Perfect Pair are seen as late career nadirs for their "pop sound". Indeed, 90125's production was the birth of Art of Noise, with its interesting sound effects and techniques, but that doesn't mean its really experimental or proggy does it? They definitely stripped off the art rock and sucked up to Trevor Horn's production on that one, whereas Invisible Touch and Three of a Perfect Pair were fine continuations of what had come before (Duke/Abacab/Genesis and Discipline/Beat). That's not to say they're not often pop or poppy, but they are hardly different from what had come directly before, which wasn't the case with 90125. Shame how critical revision excludes IT and TOAPP.

Also, as you (Mallard No. 22) hinted at, strange how these bands sounded pretty damn new wave when they were once its sworn enemies. Indeed, they all went pretty pop, and the fact that Genesis and Yes (and Queen, Dire Straits, Pink Floyd, George Harrison, Paul McCartney, Peter Gabriel, Phil Collins) all had new wave-y number 1s in the US, no thanks to the Second British Invasion, was strange considering those artists were, well, the opposite of new wave when that term first existed in 1976/77. Seeing the Wiki articles on albums like Brothers in Arms mention "new wave" as a genre seems to confirm to me that it must have lost its meaning. (Dire Straits actually started out at the same time as new wave but come from the other side of pub rock). I'm quite sure many of those artists weren't setting out to make new wave music, just music that would fit into the 80s landscape, whatever name it might have, but it isn't new wave.

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Re: The Genesis Thread

Post by KingLouieLouie76 » 01 Aug 2015, 11:20

AdvertBreak wrote:It's strange how Yes got acclaimed for 90125 when that album is perhaps the best example of prog gone pop, whereas Invisible Touch and Three of a Perfect Pair are seen as late career nadirs for their "pop sound". Indeed, 90125's production was the birth of Art of Noise, with its interesting sound effects and techniques, but that doesn't mean its really experimental or proggy does it? They definitely stripped off the art rock and sucked up to Trevor Horn's production on that one, whereas Invisible Touch and Three of a Perfect Pair were fine continuations of what had come before (Duke/Abacab/Genesis and Discipline/Beat). That's not to say they're not often pop or poppy, but they are hardly different from what had come directly before, which wasn't the case with 90125. Shame how critical revision excludes IT and TOAPP.

Also, as you (Mallard No. 22) hinted at, strange how these bands sounded pretty damn new wave when they were once its sworn enemies. Indeed, they all went pretty pop, and the fact that Genesis and Yes (and Queen, Dire Straits, Pink Floyd, George Harrison, Paul McCartney, Peter Gabriel, Phil Collins) all had new wave-y number 1s in the US, no thanks to the Second British Invasion, was strange considering those artists were, well, the opposite of new wave when that term first existed in 1976/77. Seeing the Wiki articles on albums like Brothers in Arms mention "new wave" as a genre seems to confirm to me that it must have lost its meaning. (Dire Straits actually started out at the same time as new wave but come from the other side of pub rock). I'm quite sure many of those artists weren't setting out to make new wave music, just music that would fit into the 80s landscape, whatever name it might have, but it isn't new wave.

Excellent post! We must also take into consideration that 90215 was supposed to be Cinema, but the record company pressured them to revive the Yes brand since Jon Anderson had joined the project later on. I must admit this was the first album that got me into them, but they show some of their former progressive glory on "Changes" at least.... The rest was definitely catered to MTV...IE "Owner of a Lonely Heart" and "Leave It", along w/"It Can Happen" to a certain degree.

The other bands you mentioned were victimized by how MTV was starting to dilute the music industry at that time and it has since never recovered from that.
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